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	<title>Comments on: Practicing the Presence of God</title>
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	<description>Resources for skeptical, de-converting, or former Christians......</description>
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		<title>By: pradeep</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-20721</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[pradeep]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jun 2008 17:36:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-20721</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[do u think there is god if so how do u justify...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>do u think there is god if so how do u justify&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Karen</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-709</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Karen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Apr 2007 00:25:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-709</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;Do you have a blog? I’ve loved reading your comments here.&lt;/i&gt;

Aww ... thanks so much! :-) I don&#039;t have a blog; not for lack of interest but for lack of time. 

As it is, I take an exorbitant time away from my work to read and participate at several blogs (not only religious ones) that I enjoy. Someday when I don&#039;t have to work so hard I&#039;ll probably start my own blog. In the meantime, I&#039;m enjoying this one, so thanks for being here.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Do you have a blog? I’ve loved reading your comments here.</i></p>
<p>Aww &#8230; thanks so much! <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />  I don&#8217;t have a blog; not for lack of interest but for lack of time. </p>
<p>As it is, I take an exorbitant time away from my work to read and participate at several blogs (not only religious ones) that I enjoy. Someday when I don&#8217;t have to work so hard I&#8217;ll probably start my own blog. In the meantime, I&#8217;m enjoying this one, so thanks for being here.</p>
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		<title>By: agnosticatheist</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-691</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[agnosticatheist]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2007 02:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-691</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[brad,

&lt;blockquote&gt;Personally, I find awesome “religious” experiences at a Red Hot Chili Peppers concert (no, its not just the weed speaking) just as much as at Vespers, if not moreso.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I remember watching a Garth Brooks concert on TV once and he was singing &quot;The Dance.&quot;  The camera spanned the crowd (it was in a park) and they were all singing, dancing, raising their hands, some crying.  Overall the emotions were very high.  At that moment, I realized that if he was singing a song about God, they would all think it was &quot;God&#039;s presence.&quot;

karen,

Do you have a blog?  I&#039;ve loved reading your comments here.

aA]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>brad,</p>
<blockquote><p>Personally, I find awesome “religious” experiences at a Red Hot Chili Peppers concert (no, its not just the weed speaking) just as much as at Vespers, if not moreso.</p></blockquote>
<p>I remember watching a Garth Brooks concert on TV once and he was singing &#8220;The Dance.&#8221;  The camera spanned the crowd (it was in a park) and they were all singing, dancing, raising their hands, some crying.  Overall the emotions were very high.  At that moment, I realized that if he was singing a song about God, they would all think it was &#8220;God&#8217;s presence.&#8221;</p>
<p>karen,</p>
<p>Do you have a blog?  I&#8217;ve loved reading your comments here.</p>
<p>aA</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Barnett</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-688</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Barnett]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2007 00:08:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-688</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[mTRAN:&quot;This is true of every denomination, sect, or cult. It’s also true of political parties and factions and of individuals as well...&quot;

It is not true of all, yet it is of the vast majority.  There are those of us who seek what the Bible teaches first and decide what we believe based on it.  There is not distortion in that.  My point is that the denominations that some people on here seem to have been a part of in the past have formed their beliefs and teachings and then gone to the Bible to back it up.  If you leave out the right parts, you can back up virtually any belief by doing that.  Now, do most Christians &quot;practice&quot; the presence of God?  I would have to say yesish.  However is the worshiper has the right aim in his woship(expressing love to God) this question is unimportant.  All I do in my life is in some way related to my worship of God.  I raise my kids the best I can to show them the truth and teach them to walk in it.  I do this in response to his grace in entrusting them to me.  I believe God&#039;s presence in worship is not fake, yet you don&#039;t have to feel it to know he&#039;s there.  
I appreciate your respectful response to my comment on this post.  Thanks]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mTRAN:&#8221;This is true of every denomination, sect, or cult. It’s also true of political parties and factions and of individuals as well&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>It is not true of all, yet it is of the vast majority.  There are those of us who seek what the Bible teaches first and decide what we believe based on it.  There is not distortion in that.  My point is that the denominations that some people on here seem to have been a part of in the past have formed their beliefs and teachings and then gone to the Bible to back it up.  If you leave out the right parts, you can back up virtually any belief by doing that.  Now, do most Christians &#8220;practice&#8221; the presence of God?  I would have to say yesish.  However is the worshiper has the right aim in his woship(expressing love to God) this question is unimportant.  All I do in my life is in some way related to my worship of God.  I raise my kids the best I can to show them the truth and teach them to walk in it.  I do this in response to his grace in entrusting them to me.  I believe God&#8217;s presence in worship is not fake, yet you don&#8217;t have to feel it to know he&#8217;s there.<br />
I appreciate your respectful response to my comment on this post.  Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: Karen</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-680</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Karen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 17:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-680</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;You make a very good point about what is truly experienced when singing a gospel song. It is not the praise of God or the presence of God which is present, it is a physical and emotional conditioned response.&lt;/i&gt;

This is what finally &quot;sealed the deal&quot; for me in understanding those emotion-soaked &quot;spiritual highs&quot; I had experienced a few times during my Christian years. 

At the time, I readily accepted that they were &quot;proof&quot; of the Holy Spirit moving in my heart. Later, when I was re-evaluating, I wondered how else to explain them.

Then I realized that I had &lt;i&gt;the very same kinds of feelings&lt;/i&gt; when reading highly inspiring poetry, listening to gorgeous music, or - like HeIsSailing - contemplating the vastness and mystery of the universe in relation to my own tiny insigificance.

It&#039;s all emotion and brain rush and a chemical reaction. There&#039;s nothing supernatural needed to explain it, and clinical though the actual explanation is, it does nothing to diminish the power of the experience, or the insight it provides, at least for me.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>You make a very good point about what is truly experienced when singing a gospel song. It is not the praise of God or the presence of God which is present, it is a physical and emotional conditioned response.</i></p>
<p>This is what finally &#8220;sealed the deal&#8221; for me in understanding those emotion-soaked &#8220;spiritual highs&#8221; I had experienced a few times during my Christian years. </p>
<p>At the time, I readily accepted that they were &#8220;proof&#8221; of the Holy Spirit moving in my heart. Later, when I was re-evaluating, I wondered how else to explain them.</p>
<p>Then I realized that I had <i>the very same kinds of feelings</i> when reading highly inspiring poetry, listening to gorgeous music, or &#8211; like HeIsSailing &#8211; contemplating the vastness and mystery of the universe in relation to my own tiny insigificance.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s all emotion and brain rush and a chemical reaction. There&#8217;s nothing supernatural needed to explain it, and clinical though the actual explanation is, it does nothing to diminish the power of the experience, or the insight it provides, at least for me.</p>
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		<title>By: MTran</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-668</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MTran]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 05:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-668</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;Dartmouth did a study(and we can agree that they would not be leaning to the Christian side of arguments) and found that every human is born “hardwired” to connect to something spiritually higher than his/herself.&lt;/i&gt;

This would be expected of social creatures such as humans.  Throughout history, people have &quot;connected&quot; to something &quot;more&quot; than themselves, often giving their lives in the process.

That something, in ancient times, was often the family, the tribe or the city / polis.  Patriots of any nation are clearly &quot;connecting&quot; to something they deem greater than themselves.  As are those who act heroically to save another.

&lt;i&gt;These denominations have twisted the Bible to fit their own agenda. &lt;/i&gt;

This is true of &lt;i&gt;&lt;b&gt;every&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt; denomination, sect, or cult.  It&#039;s also true of political parties and factions and of individuals as well. 

Sometimes it&#039;s a simple matter of perspective, other times it&#039;s outright distortion.

It&#039;s something that is done not just with the Bible but with many other significant texts or historic events.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Dartmouth did a study(and we can agree that they would not be leaning to the Christian side of arguments) and found that every human is born “hardwired” to connect to something spiritually higher than his/herself.</i></p>
<p>This would be expected of social creatures such as humans.  Throughout history, people have &#8220;connected&#8221; to something &#8220;more&#8221; than themselves, often giving their lives in the process.</p>
<p>That something, in ancient times, was often the family, the tribe or the city / polis.  Patriots of any nation are clearly &#8220;connecting&#8221; to something they deem greater than themselves.  As are those who act heroically to save another.</p>
<p><i>These denominations have twisted the Bible to fit their own agenda. </i></p>
<p>This is true of <i><b>every</b></i> denomination, sect, or cult.  It&#8217;s also true of political parties and factions and of individuals as well. </p>
<p>Sometimes it&#8217;s a simple matter of perspective, other times it&#8217;s outright distortion.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s something that is done not just with the Bible but with many other significant texts or historic events.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Barnett</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-661</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Barnett]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 02:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-661</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Unfortunately you came from a charismatic, &quot;crazy&quot; singin&#039; church.  All the arguments I see many of you making is based on your view of what God would be.  You think that emotions are wrong to have in worship.  First, worship is more than singing.  Paul says to offer your body as a living sacrifice, for this your reasonable act of worship.  Now don&#039;t misquote me and say hey we&#039;re supposed to kill ourselves.   All that we do is to be pointed to one thing, and that is to glorify God.  Aa, I think you mentioned your wife at one point on your site, so I will assume I remember that correctly and therefore you&#039;re married.  When you are telling your wife how beautiful she is, and expressing your love to her, do you feel void of emotion?  Only a corspe would.  The same is true of God.  You cannot express your love, adoration, gratitude, etc. to him without feeling emotion.  Praise and worship is not intended to bring a high or a supernatural feeling.  You can&#039;t base your whole argument against Christianity against one sector of it (Pentecostal, 4-square, Assembly of God).  These denominations have twisted the Bible to fit their own agenda.  By the way, Dartmouth did a study(and we can agree that they would not be leaning to the Christian side of arguments) and found that every human is born &quot;hardwired&quot; to connect to something spiritually higher than his/herself.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unfortunately you came from a charismatic, &#8220;crazy&#8221; singin&#8217; church.  All the arguments I see many of you making is based on your view of what God would be.  You think that emotions are wrong to have in worship.  First, worship is more than singing.  Paul says to offer your body as a living sacrifice, for this your reasonable act of worship.  Now don&#8217;t misquote me and say hey we&#8217;re supposed to kill ourselves.   All that we do is to be pointed to one thing, and that is to glorify God.  Aa, I think you mentioned your wife at one point on your site, so I will assume I remember that correctly and therefore you&#8217;re married.  When you are telling your wife how beautiful she is, and expressing your love to her, do you feel void of emotion?  Only a corspe would.  The same is true of God.  You cannot express your love, adoration, gratitude, etc. to him without feeling emotion.  Praise and worship is not intended to bring a high or a supernatural feeling.  You can&#8217;t base your whole argument against Christianity against one sector of it (Pentecostal, 4-square, Assembly of God).  These denominations have twisted the Bible to fit their own agenda.  By the way, Dartmouth did a study(and we can agree that they would not be leaning to the Christian side of arguments) and found that every human is born &#8220;hardwired&#8221; to connect to something spiritually higher than his/herself.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-660</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 00:15:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-660</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&gt;&gt;in reality, it was more about self-gratification]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;in reality, it was more about self-gratification</p>
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		<title>By: Simen</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-655</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Simen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Apr 2007 23:02:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-655</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Believers will only answer that it&#039;s natural for humans to develop a god center in the brain if there is a god, and they will say that it&#039;s natural for there to be false positives, just like we can see or hear or feel hallucinations. So, while it totally blows out of the water any claims that personal experiences are proof of a god, it doesn&#039;t disprove a god.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Believers will only answer that it&#8217;s natural for humans to develop a god center in the brain if there is a god, and they will say that it&#8217;s natural for there to be false positives, just like we can see or hear or feel hallucinations. So, while it totally blows out of the water any claims that personal experiences are proof of a god, it doesn&#8217;t disprove a god.</p>
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		<title>By: BlackSun</title>
		<link>http://de-conversion.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god/#comment-654</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[BlackSun]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Apr 2007 22:26:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agnosticatheism.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/practicing-the-presence-of-god-an-atheist-perspective/#comment-654</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is the thesis of both &quot;Breaking the Spell,&quot; by Daniel Dennett, and &quot;The God Part of the Brain&quot; by Matthew Alper. Andrew Newberg also discussed this in &quot;Why God Won&#039;t Go Away,&quot; although Newberg&#039;s analysis moves quickly from science to religious apology.

My point is this is becoming an undeniable fact supported by copious research, even some by believers such as Newberg. God is fully created by the human brain, and when we experience &#039;god,&#039; it is our brain being high on itself. Period.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is the thesis of both &#8220;Breaking the Spell,&#8221; by Daniel Dennett, and &#8220;The God Part of the Brain&#8221; by Matthew Alper. Andrew Newberg also discussed this in &#8220;Why God Won&#8217;t Go Away,&#8221; although Newberg&#8217;s analysis moves quickly from science to religious apology.</p>
<p>My point is this is becoming an undeniable fact supported by copious research, even some by believers such as Newberg. God is fully created by the human brain, and when we experience &#8216;god,&#8217; it is our brain being high on itself. Period.</p>
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