Ouch harsh.

115. Quester | April 11, 2008 at 7:46 pm

“If we are bothering anyone, I’m sure Zachary would be willing for us to move this over to my blog. In fact, Zachary? This is dd’s article, and we’re not exactly replying to it. I’m beginning to feel like an uncourteous guest. Hoping you don’t mind, I’ll open a thread on my blog for us to continue this.”

Yeah I kinda felt bad about that, the whole time but people didn’t seem to mind. Go ahead and post the link so if some random person come to check it out 50 years from now lol. I would hardly call it mental masturbation, because what we are talking about is fundimental to life styles and even I have grown and learned alot more clearly what i believe and rooted out a bit of nonsense in my belief as wwe have gone. Any till next episode…er…post.

True, but not infinitely infinite. *grin*

I must say think that discussion has gone off into meaningless philosophical BS if you ask me. I call it mental masturbation.

Well, yes, but I figure we’re enjoying ourselves and not hurting anyone else. This is something I do for fun and stress relief, and I often get to learn something.

If we are bothering anyone, I’m sure Zachary would be willing for us to move this over to my blog. In fact, Zachary? This is dd’s article, and we’re not exactly replying to it. I’m beginning to feel like an uncourteous guest. Hoping you don’t mind, I’ll open a thread on my blog for us to continue this.

That’s not true, actually.

The set of all whole numbers (1, 2, 3, etc.) is infinite but it is a subset of the set of all real numbers (1, 1.1, 1.2… 2, 2.1, 2.2, etc.).

That’s oversimplified, but a subdivision can still be infinite.

Glad you’re having fun, but I really don’t see the point of most of what has been said recently. I must say think that discussion has gone off into meaningless philosophical BS if you ask me. I call it mental masturbation.

“If it is a subdivision, it is finite (limited to within that subdivision).”

Your right! Thats why true infinity is only God. God is Infinity in quality, order, and quantity. As i said before though infinity, as we use it, is God in reference to quantity only.

“I think I know what you’re trying to say, but could you add a verb to that sentence to help me out?

lol yeah I am a total dork. it’s a wonder how people ever understand me. : p. Anyway, I was saying God is unsubdivided quantity, order (or direction of movment), and quality. I really don’t know how else to say it.

3) God’s self-revelation:

“So, it has nothing to do with our choice, but that of someone who came before us?”

Original sin or nature sin does was not originated by us .

“By the way, do you believe that the story of Adam and Eve happened as depicted in Genesis?”

Yes, though i do think I depart from some traditional views. There are many things I am not sure of about it and I am willing to be corrected by someone I trust on the issue. I believe the jist of it in the tradisional way though.

“Why are we not born into the nature that Christ (the second Adam) chose?”

Because we are not begotton of Christ nature naturally, but trusting (belief) in knowledge that is taught(faith) of Christ. We have relationship with Jesus by our humanity, and by that relationship we can choose to follow Him as God or not if we have been lead to the ablility to make that choice. This is how we Have knowledge of God as he is not just partial knowledge of His existence.

“Not really. It is either up to us, or up to God. If it depends on our choice, then our salvation is by our own action (the act of choosing).”

It make sense to me. Maybe I am missing somethng, but to me if God has to do something to bring you to that choice, and God made that choice possible, and God is that choice. Seems like it’s is by grace through faith to me.

“If I can’t find Christ, I can’t follow Him. If I can’t understand His will, I can’t submit to it. I can be as willing as anything or anyone, but I can’t listen to someone who does not speak.”

Well, you do have an understanding of what he want, which is to love God with all your heart mind soul and strength. The you have the bible and other Christians and virtues men athiest or pagan or what have you, and all creation to lead you to know him once you have the basis of knowledge. You start by pretending to be like Christ, till you learn to be like Him. Till you habits and knolwedge line up with your intetion.

“Interesting theology. Could you expand on that?”

I will go into it next chance i can i gtg my times up.

Sorry, I was wrong to say that it has no quality. I meant, I am using quality w/o -, just +. It is a simple subdivsion of quality.

God Infinity in quality, order, and quantity

I think I know what you’re trying to say, but could you add a verb to that sentence to help me out?

3) God’s self-revelation:

Man chose knowledge w/o or not of God, we are begotten af man in that condition.

So, it has nothing to do with our choice, but that of someone who came before us? By the way, do you believe that the story of Adam and Eve happened as depicted in Genesis?

We are that choice, because we are begotton of Adam’s natural condition that he chose. We are by nature a slave to that choice.

Why are we not born into the nature that Christ (the second Adam) chose?

It’s not by work, God has to lead you to the choice, and he made the choice possible by His son. So it is not by you alone, but it is you in part. Does that make sense?

Not really. It is either up to us, or up to God. If it depends on our choice, then our salvation is by our own action (the act of choosing).

“Why is my choice in relationship to man predicated by the first Adam but my choice in relationship to God is not predicated by the second.”

One by is your nature in relation to what it is begotten from, the other is by the fact we are indivduals, and not Adam himself.

Er.. by “the second” I meant the second Adam (ie. Christ).

You have the power to say, even though it is seems contradictory, vauge, and foolish in someways, that you postpone those beliefs and trust Christ. You can trust from what is seemingly not contradictory, foolish, and vauge. Weither you are willing to lay down what doesn’t make sense for what does, is of course always your choice as an invividual, and in this case, it involes Christ.

If I can’t find Christ, I can’t follow Him. If I can’t understand His will, I can’t submit to it. I can be as willing as anything or anyone, but I can’t listen to someone who does not speak.

In the end, He is to make those who hate Him his foot stool. He will resurect those who love Him and those who don’t will make Him more apparently Lord. He will make good out of those who do not love Him to bless those that do.

Interesting theology. Could you expand on that?

“Lost me again. How is infinity pure quantity?”

Sorry, I was wrong to say that it has no quality. I meant, I am using quality w/o -, just +. It is a simple subdivsion of quality.

“What is quantity without quality? Are you saying God has no quality (or qualifiers)?”

God Infinity in quality, order, and quantity

2) God’s morality:
“No. You seem to be arguing that God revealing Himself to the Israelites does not counter free will, but God revealing Himself to everyone else would. How do you reach such a conclusion?”

It was because of the helpless condition of the isrialites, as slaves, that qualified them. They were at the end of there rope and the only thing you can do there is look up. Either to curse or to plead for help. It was a nation of people in this condition, already open to God helping. So God revealed Himself in a denyable way because in this place and time it was effective to lead men to God.

3) God’s self-revelation:

“How does lacking choice come out of what we chose?”

Man chose knowledge w/o or not of God, we are begotten af man in that condition.

“What choices did we make before we were born?”

We are that choice, because we are begotton of Adam’s natural condition that he chose. We are by nature a slave to that choice.

“Which is completely counter to Paul’s descriptions of salvation by grace alone, with the impossibility of any righteousness under law.”

It’s not by work, God has to lead you to the choice, and he made the choice possible by His son. So it is not by you alone, but it is you in part. Does that make sense?

“Why is my choice in relationship to man predicated by the first Adam but my choice in relationship to God is not predicated by the second.”

One by is your nature in relation to what it is begotten from, the other is by the fact we are indivduals, and not Adam himself.

“Yet I can not figure out, due to His vague and contradictory revelations, what He intends. Therefore, I can not intend it myself and am thus condemned.”

You have the power to say, even though it is seems contradictory, vauge, and foolish in someways, that you postpone those beliefs and trust Christ. You can trust from what is seemingly not contradictory, foolish, and vauge. Weither you are willing to lay down what doesn’t make sense for what does, is of course always your choice as an invividual, and in this case, it involes Christ.

“Partial conquering is not conquering at all. This Christ is barely allowed to save face by taking a precious few home with Him as He retreats out of the lands of the dead. The grave still has its victory. Death still has its sting.”

In the end, He is to make those who hate Him his foot stool. He will resurect those who love Him and those who don’t will make Him more apparently Lord. He will make good out of those who do not love Him to bless those that do.